Ep. 135 - Long-Distance Love: Making It Work Miles Apart
Distance makes the heart grow fonder—or does it? In this episode, we explore long-distance relationships and what the research actually shows about couples who love across miles. We share our own varied experiences with long-distance love—from casual dating situations to serious commitments. Different relationship styles and personal attachment patterns dramatically impact how well distance works. Low-jealousy partners may thrive while anxious attachment can transform distance from challenging to excruciating.
Communication presents unique hurdles when you're apart—text messages lose tone, calls require scheduling, and the spontaneity of everyday connection disappears. We identify creative strategies that help bridge the gap. The ultimate question emerges: is long-distance simply pressing pause on your relationship, or can it actually strengthen your connection in ways proximity never could?
Whether you're contemplating a period apart from your partner or currently navigating the challenges of loving from afar, w e explore how to maintain connection when miles separate you from the one you love—and when to know if the distance might actually be revealing deeper relationship incompatibilities.
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Jacqueline (00:00.953)
Hey guys, today we are going back to dating, which I think you all know is one of our favorite topics ever. We're gonna do one that is particularly relevant to me at the moment, but both Kibby and I have experience with it, which is long distance relationships. So, I have been in so many long distance relationships, not all of them like exclusive, but I've dated guys long distance like a thousand times, and now Jason and I are doing a year because I'm in New York, but that's a more like...
classic, like we're actually, we actually love each other, we're actually in a relationship versus some of my others were a little bit different. But we want to tell you a little bit about what the data says. Fair warning, it's mixed. And then just kind of go into like what works, what doesn't work and tips. Kibby, can you tell us, speaking of tips, how KulaMind could help any of our listeners who are in long distance relationships.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (00:55.072)
Yeah, so in KulaMind, again, we are giving support and community around people who want to break free of toxic relationships, especially. Getting a lot of that people with a loved one with mental illness, like a personality disorder or addiction or other kind of emotional issues. And we're getting a lot of people who have partners with anger issues that tends to be people who are, you know, reaching out to us for help.
If you just want to talk and see what we have to offer in terms of how we can support you through that relationship, go to the link in the show notes or check out Kulamind.com. For example, we're helping people just understanding what's going on with their loved one, setting healthy boundaries, not going nuts themselves, learning how to validate and support them through their emotional crises, but also without losing yourself at the same time.
That's what we have to offer at KulaMind.
Jacqueline (01:52.757)
Amazing. When we were looking at the data, I was surprised to see how close the results are between close proximity relationships and long distance relationships. I didn't find data that said, you're screwed if you're in a long distance relationship, for instance. So there was actually some data that was positive, that there were higher levels of dedication and commitment in long distance relationships. Whenever it's just one study, we can never take it that seriously.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (01:57.838)
you
Jacqueline (02:21.849)
And it just goes to show, like, it's not, the research doesn't, doesn't tend to say that, like, you're doomed if you're in a long-distance relationship. I think an important thing to think about, though, is what are we really talking about when we're talking about long-distance? Like, the difference between somebody living in Manhattan and Princeton, New Jersey, is way different than somebody living in New York with somebody in Australia.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (02:30.872)
Mm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (02:48.696)
Mm.
Jacqueline (02:49.581)
And the difference between what Jason and I are doing, which is we have a defined period of time with an end date versus two people who maybe met long distance, right, have no idea when they're going to be together. Like all of that really changes the landscape of the relationship. And I'm not sure how research can really account for all of that. I'm guessing it's averaging.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (03:10.718)
Yeah, that's really good point. I imagine that long distance generally just means the two people are located in different places where they have to travel to see each other. then, yeah, what's the difference between that and like if someone lives in New Jersey and they're like an hour and a half away from their loved one in New York. So yeah, so I guess like the definition of long distance, like how long are we talking about here?
Jacqueline (03:40.345)
And for how long?
Dr. Kibby McMahon (03:40.41)
but should we just assume there needs to be like a, like a more than a two hour drive or like a plane ride or something? Just when you don't see that person regularly and you have to travel to see them would be what I consider long distance. and things must've changed so much during COVID too, in terms of long distance, because people were stuck in different countries and during lockdown, like different locations, you know, like married couples that I know were.
Jacqueline (03:52.695)
Right.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (04:10.464)
One of my really good friends, like her husband had to keep working in New York because his job had people coming in and then she went back to Europe with her and her kid. And so they were long distance for about like a year and a half or something like that.
Jacqueline (04:28.227)
Your washing machine is like buzzing. Can you hear that from your?
Dr. Kibby McMahon (04:31.894)
I can hear that, we could probably like filter it out.
Jacqueline (04:36.313)
OK, it's very loud. Yeah, I mean, it was funny. My friend Emma Gray just got married, and she and her boyfriend were both New Yorkers. But there's a New York Times article that came out about how their romance was one where he had to walk miles every time he wanted to see her because they lived in different boroughs, and he didn't want to take the subway. So it was like a long distance relationship within New York City.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (04:38.616)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (05:03.939)
But I do, like, I've heard from so many people and so many times that, like, the secret to long distance is knowing when it will no longer be long distance. But I don't know. An interesting thing is, like, I'm watching my sister date who is about to turn 48. And it's like every single person she dates is long distance because the pool gets so narrow.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (05:11.662)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (05:26.785)
So she and all of these men in their 50s that she's going out with are setting their online dating distance measures to include the entire Eastern seaboard. And I don't know when they would stop being long distance, but you think about different goals.
I have super different relationship goals than my sister does because I am in my early 30s, I'm looking to have somebody start a family with me and have babies with me. Like, proximity is imperative. She has already had her kids. She's more looking to just like have fun, have a companion, travel with somebody. So I would think relationship goals would really influence the health of your long distance relationship as well.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (06:13.996)
Yeah, that's really cool. I didn't think about it until you were talking about it, about the age. When people are more or less comfortable with that, I imagine when you're in your 20s, long distance relationship feels like, OK. And then later on, after just the period of time where you want to settle down and get married and have young kids, that must be the highest time where long distance might be super stressful. For example, you and your period of time versus if you were 10 years younger might feel differently.
Jacqueline (06:42.611)
I had to just, I just had to lean straight into acceptance. mean, before I placed in New York, before I matched in New York for internship, I was telling myself it was going to be disastrous if I did not place in North Carolina because I was like, you know.
This year with Jason could have been a year that we got to spend together. We spent strengthening our relationship and then getting ready to have a child. I could have been pregnant this year, and we...
I could have had those nice 33 year old eggs and instead I'm like, this is a year that not only doesn't move us forward, but takes away from us. And so now I'm gonna have to postpone getting pregnant, not just by a year, but by two years because even coming back then he's wanting to make up for all the lost time.
What he doesn't want is for me to come home and be like, yay, I'm off birth control. Let's get pregnant immediately. Coming off of this year of long distance, now let's do all of that. So I just really had to be like, you know what? It's a good thing I froze my eggs. And we're just going to push off this baby thing. I mean, could have done it a different way, but it didn't really work for him.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (07:39.96)
Mm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (08:00.632)
So how did you, so you're talking about the long distance between North Carolina and New York, and that's about an hour flight. And you're really busy, both of you are busy at work. How did you talk about setting up this period of long distance? Like how are you gonna navigate it? were like the, know, expectations?
Jacqueline (08:08.771)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (08:24.257)
Yeah, I mean, didn't have a ton of talk. We didn't have a ton of conversation about it. We did talk about it. We were like, OK, it's definitely exclusive. Like, we're not doing any kind of open arrangement.
Jacqueline (08:40.279)
was like my preference would be to know when the next time I will see you is before each visit ends. I do find that to be helpful. We talked a little bit about hypotheticals, but I mean, we didn't have as much preparation as maybe we should have or maybe other people should have. I think we've been fine having a pretty flexible.
arrangement like honestly long distance has been a breeze for me. It's not ideal. I would rather not be long distance, but it hasn't been something where I feel like communicating more at the outset would have been important. But I also think that's extremely relationship specific. Like I could have never done this with my ex. I think it really, the, mean, I'm trying to think of what the biggest.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (09:23.109)
Why? What's the difference?
Jacqueline (09:30.007)
The most obvious one that jumps out is that Jason is low jealousy and my ex was high jealousy. I think this would just be so hard. I'm so worried about this. You don't think it's going to be a major, like it's really loud in here.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (09:46.198)
I hear like, but really softly. And I think that we could do things to like isolate your voice or we could wait a few minutes until it dies down.
Jacqueline (09:56.825)
I don't know, I hope y'all is not gonna be mad.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (10:00.246)
No, I mean, I could do a little more talking at this stage until it turns or I don't know, we could just kind of wait.
Jacqueline (10:06.339)
Well, whatever. mean, I guess I'll just say, think Jason and I have several things going for us. One is that we are both low jealousy. Like, I have not had the thought ever, I wonder if Jason is meeting another woman right now. Now, some of that is on me and my amazing regulation when it comes to jealousy. But a lot of it is on the fact that.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (10:16.718)
you
Jacqueline (10:32.473)
He just doesn't like go out. I'm just knowing his lifestyle like there's really genuinely is nothing for me to be worried about. Like I would I would have to be actively paranoid to imagine that he was up to anything. His job, I mean what he's doing is far more impressive because I actually am going out all the time with other men who are buying me dinner and taking me to shows. And they're like things he wants to do you know like I went to see.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (10:45.326)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (10:59.533)
Glen Ross with my friend Jeff and Jayden's like, one of my favorite movies with Kieran Culkin and Bob Oertkirk. Okay, who are you going with again? You know, so I mean, we really should have him on to see how he's doing with this.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (11:02.177)
huh.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (11:11.342)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (11:20.505)
I mean, I think that we both have this value of like trust your pay trust your partner until there's a reason not to and of like Genuinely wanting the other person to be supported in their happiness Like he's not gonna win anything if he tries to curtail my freedom. It's not gonna give him more freedom It's certainly not gonna give him more love and affection It will build resentment You know, so
Dr. Kibby McMahon (11:47.406)
Mm-hmm.
Do you feel like you're worried that this would just be like a huge hold on your relationship and like you wouldn't be able to further develop it or deepen it, as if it was pressing the pause button on your relationship? Do you still feel like that? No.
Jacqueline (12:07.916)
No.
I don't, mean, in certain ways I do, but I think overall long distance has actually given us an opportunity to have something that is difficult to have in North Carolina, which is extended quality time. So what we've traded for consistent time, I think we've gotten in quality time because he has a son. And over the weekends when I'm in North Carolina, it's not just the two of us hanging out. It's like we have to entertain his kid and include Kai, which is fine.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (12:23.288)
Mmm.
Jacqueline (12:40.279)
but it's hard to have like three or four days where we're just going on dates all the time and I've seen him in a place where he's much more able to cut loose and Just be like let's party like let's I mean he like flies up here buys a carton of cigarettes he doesn't normally smoke and it's just like Let's let's just yeah, let's party
Dr. Kibby McMahon (12:58.964)
for it. Interesting. I mean, a lot of what you're saying, it does make sense for the research that we are glancing through. mean, that there, it can be really stressful. One of the, one of the sources of stress is the obvious problems when you don't see a person every day, like the relationship uncertainty, right? Like how
What are we going to have? Especially if you don't have plans to get together in the same location, like how do we deal with that? Like when are we going to be together? What's the future going to look like? And what are they doing when I'm not there, right? you know, can they fully, you know, have another affair or relationship at the same time? You know, you have to put a lot of trust in that person because you only have one.
Jacqueline (13:37.528)
you
Jacqueline (13:53.293)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (13:57.762)
like very few sources of information about them versus like if you're living with them, you could get, you know, what they look like coming home from work or, you know, just like the day-to-day contact. but.
Jacqueline (14:11.821)
Yeah, I I could absolutely be holding an affair right now. And it would be super easy to keep from Jason. I just wouldn't be, I have all the time in the world, and I'm out all the time. I mean, this is just him trusting me. And I got cheated on when I was in a long distance relationship. So Eric, the one, yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (14:30.574)
with him.
Oh, right. All right. How did it hap- wait, you were long distance in that relationship? I you were both in New York.
Jacqueline (14:45.131)
It started when we were both in New York, but I was only, I wasn't living in New York back then. I was just coming up for like summers and.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (14:53.582)
I didn't know that. Okay, this was when you were in Charleston? interesting. I didn't know that, okay.
Jacqueline (14:54.745)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (15:03.127)
Yeah, yeah, he was, it was always confusing, know, because sometimes we would be exclusive, most of the time we weren't, but yeah, he, he was, he had lots of extracurriculars going on.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (15:07.338)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (15:18.36)
Did you have any, did you have any like suspicion or?
Jacqueline (15:23.417)
No, which is super stupid because he's absolutely the type. mean, and he was cheating on his wife. So like with me, you know, I mean, so it's just, they were estranged, yada, yada, yada. But yeah, no, I mean, I think he had a whole kind of harem situation going.
And then he had this girl who he was also long distance with, and she thought that they were in an exclusive relationship. And I thought we were in exclusive relationship, and he was cheating on both of us. So we had a call in the airport, I remember once, where I was like, yeah, this is my side, what's your side? We were comparing notes. It was fun times.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (16:01.452)
Would he come to visit both of you or you two would rotate visiting him?
Jacqueline (16:07.737)
So I'll give you my favorite example, which is my brother was getting married in Charleston and I invited him to come with me and he said yes and he had booked his flight and everything and then he wound up not coming because there was a hurricane and
Dr. Kibby McMahon (16:07.982)
Thank
Jacqueline (16:24.345)
that's fine, right? Like a lot of people didn't come because there was a hurricane, except he became very spotty at communication and like didn't call to tell me he just texted and then like kind of didn't, wasn't responsive the rest of the weekend. I was extremely upset. And then when I found out about this other girlfriend and I was on the phone with her, I was like, was there ever a time in like,
early October where he said he had a business trip or anything. She was like, he said he had a wedding. I was like, okay. He was bold enough to say what it was. She was like, yeah, he was like looking for rental cars, you know, while we were sitting on the couch. So, I mean, you know, he was gonna spend the weekend with my family at a wedding and he was looking for rental cars with his other girlfriend.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (17:02.7)
Wow, that is...
Dr. Kibby McMahon (17:11.618)
Wow, that's bold.
Jacqueline (17:15.607)
Yeah, yeah, can't accuse him of not being a bold cheater.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (17:23.884)
I mean, the amount of logistics that tend to go in a long distance relationship anyway, mean, to do that with multiple people seems crazy, but yeah, I feel like, you know, when it comes to infidelity, this could happen in any relationship, whether it's long distance or whatever, you know, so it's...
I don't know if long distance necessarily means more cheating, I definitely, I really did like, whenever I was in a long distance relationship, I did like what you described, whereas it feels like a special time for your relationship. I actually quite like autonomy in my relationships and it felt nice to kind of do my own thing and then on day-to-day basis, stay in contact, but then,
have a weekend or a week where you just are visiting with each other and you do special things. It's like a full date that's like a weekend long. And it's, you know, so you kind of have a little bit of a honeymoon-y feeling where, you know, you really dedicate that quality time together because you're like, oh my gosh, I have to pack all of physical contact into these dates that we have together.
And then you get excited, the loop of you get excited as it's coming up, you start to plan what you do. And then, you know, any kind of interruption, like someone's sick and they can't, or they miss their flight is devastating. And then when you do have it, it's amazing. And then when, then like you start to get sad when they're gone and you know, there's just like this really, it's almost like built in emotional roller coaster when it comes to visiting them.
Jacqueline (19:10.369)
Yeah, I think you have to balance to the need to see each other regularly, but also the need to like not not just exist in the place that you're in locationally. Like Jason and I had an intended to do every two weeks and it's gone down to once a month. And I think a big part of that is like it would just simply be more of a pain in the ass and just missing out on our
like regular lives to be trying to visit that often. Like if I knew that I would only have every other weekend in New York, it just, I don't know, it would be easier if I didn't have to write a dissertation at the same time, but it would start to feel as if I'm not really living in New York, I'm just like waiting to go to North Carolina. So I don't know, I mean if I had more PTO maybe it would be better, but I didn't, what I didn't want to do was just like not really experience being here. And what I do like about this,
What I like about this being an interrupter of the relationship is that when we get into long-term relationships, I think we can forget how competent we are when we're single. Like we can forget that we actually do possess the ability to like lead our own lives and take care of ourselves. And then when you're in long distance, all of that kind of comes back to you quickly. And I think just like remembering that lesson periodically can be really helpful.
Especially if you're not convinced you're gonna marry your partner. Because I remember like when I was with Paul I was so scared to break up because I was like I don't even remember how to be on my own anymore. Like I don't remember what it's like to be single and then as soon as I was single again I was like yeah right back on the bike. But it I don't know it was just like it was nice to get that lesson. Like I know I'll be okay. I know I'll be okay on my own. I know how to do this.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (20:59.246)
Yeah, you definitely have an experience, like an interesting experience of being single and being self-sufficient at the same time being in a very committed relationship that is just founded on the emotional connection, like the talking. It makes me think a little bit about Love is Blind, just because I'm a big fan of that show. But it's like, what happens when you distill an entire relationship down to just the conversations you're having and the trips?
Jacqueline (21:09.945)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (21:27.993)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (21:28.61)
There was some research showing that some long distance relationships can be even emotionally closer, more resilient, because not only are you dealing with a relationship challenge on its own, but you learn to have an entire relationship through talking. And there a lot of relationships in person where you don't have such an emphasis on like, okay, I'm gonna have to talk to this person and tell them about my day and tell them how I'm feeling. Yeah, so you're just like...
you know, you don't take each other for granted. The contact between you and the interaction between you is really intentional and planned and necessary.
Jacqueline (22:07.705)
Yeah, I think that there is definitely a benefit there. There can also be a downside. Like I'll say Jason and I don't actually talk on the phone that much. I think we had intended to a lot more, like at least weekly. And we probably are talking on the phone at least weekly, but it's not necessarily like a three hour phone date or a particularly long phone conversation. And they're always good. I, you know, I worry my, my biggest
worry going into long distance was that we would lose our chemistry because I know from doing long distance in the past like sometimes it can be hard to keep up the natural flow of conversation when you're long distance because the things that can bind you together even just like when you're when you're like walking down the street together right seeing the same things being able to point out the same observations right like that can be pretty binding and then in long distance it can be like
I mean, when Jason and I ask each other how our days are, there's a very good chance I'm gonna be like, yeah, like I went to Michelin star restaurant and then like, you know, went to a Broadway show or like, and he's like, uh-huh, uh-huh, cool, yeah, I went to work and then I watched a movie with Kai, now I'm going to bed. It's like the same every time, right? So wait.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (23:32.602)
So it's really hard for you to be in long distance relationship because your life in New York is more awesome than his? Okay, yeah. That's hard. I'm so sorry. Different experiences.
Jacqueline (23:36.153)
He's so much better than his. I know.
Jacqueline (23:42.137)
No, but what I mean is like we're just having we're having really disparate experiences and I know he is he'll name that right he'll be like Just doing the same thing as always. I wish I had some cool stories to tell you but like When I'm in North Carolina, I also have that like lame life But it's just we're commenting on things together throughout the day like commenting on what we're eating together what we're watching together like what we see on the street together like there's just
content that's always available versus like long distance. I mean, we've been doing fine genuinely, but a lot of the time it's like, this is what I did. cool. How was that show? How was that movie? And then you kind of like run into a dead end kind of quickly.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (24:22.872)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (24:27.158)
Yeah, yeah, you you're just reporting on your individual experiences, whereas a lot of relationship is like the different perspectives on the same thing that you're sharing. And there's a lot of well, text messaging may may change this, but in when you're living together, you can have these spontaneous chats or hugs or like.
Jacqueline (24:31.275)
Exactly.
Jacqueline (24:39.98)
Right, exactly.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (24:54.026)
non-force organic interaction, whereas I remember a long distance relationship, it was like, okay, now it's our time to talk. And so you have to talk. And sometimes you're tired and you just want to be with the person. But I don't know, maybe other people, I think there's other relationships I heard, especially around COVID, that got used to like a Zoom relationship where they would just have the Zoom on, or the webcam on, and then they would just work or exist or hang out.
Jacqueline (25:07.448)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (25:23.171)
Great.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (25:23.534)
without pressure to talk to each other. And I never really did that before. That's just interesting to feel because sometimes it was like, okay, this is our scheduled talk. I have to think about something interesting to talk about. It was such a forced conversation that it took the spontaneity out of it.
Jacqueline (25:27.469)
pressure rate.
Jacqueline (25:36.857)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (25:45.943)
Yeah, I think Jason and I have been just sort of coasting along in this, that we haven't had to get too creative with things. Like, it's just been good enough. And it's been great in some ways. Like, the visits are amazing, and talking to him is great. But I don't think either of us see this as like...
Okay, we need to like save our relationship or like we've really got to amplify this year so that X like I think we're just kind of like, yeah, this is fine. And it's going to end thank God on x day. But I don't think that's a bad idea. Like just having your person in your pocket, like with you while you do things. And that sounds kind of nice. I will say like one of the reasons we don't have that many phone calls is probably because I don't like phone calls, especially with what we do for a living. It's just like, I just talk to people all day.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (26:32.462)
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (26:38.414)
I had a thought, no. My, I had a bunch. I had one in college, which who was my first husband. it's interesting. And when you said that you don't really live in the place because you're traveling and seeing them all the time and like your heart is somewhere else, that definitely happened to me. And actually my current husband is sad.
Jacqueline (26:40.003)
Well, what were your long distance relationships like?
Jacqueline (27:03.737)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (27:08.974)
about my long distance relationship in college because Alex and I lived together as like college roommates in senior year. And he was so excited. I went abroad for a little bit. And so we were so excited to like finally get like the senior cool, you know, townhouse, you know, living. And then it was our last year, like big hurrah. And then I started seeing my ex-husband.
Jacqueline (27:18.425)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (27:38.51)
who was a couple states away, so I'd to go to a really long bus ride. And we would do every other weekend or so, him here or me there. And whenever we were together, we were just in the couple world in that weekend. So I wouldn't even see my friends. I even was super late, like two hours late for my own party at our own college dorm, which I feel really sad about.
Jacqueline (28:04.408)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (28:06.254)
And yeah, Alex of this day was like, yeah, I thought I was gonna live with you and you were never there. So it's kind of ironic. I, and I started as a long distance relationship. He was living in LA when we got together and he was doing law school. And we got together when he came for a summer here to hang out with me.
and then he had to go back to law school and then finish it up and then we were like, we'll be together at some point. But that was really tough because I think that at the time we weren't sure how to navigate that coming together. The move wasn't really clear. He wanted me to move to California or like had some dreams of it and I...
Jacqueline (28:44.195)
Mm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (29:01.71)
was in North Carolina. There was just a lot of different pieces about what our future looked like. And at the time, I was actually really anxious because I thought I wasn't fertile. I was like, you know, we don't, you know, I was like 34, 35 at the time. I was like, you know, we gotta get on this, you know? And he had two more years of law school left. Like, what were we gonna do?
Jacqueline (29:19.544)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (29:26.862)
you know, spend some, like, some time. I didn't know what to do. I really, I was scared of the timeline. I was scared of the distance. In my mind, it would have been like a couple years before we had a family. And I made that very clear that I was like really panicked about the timeline. And one of our trips, one of our, you know, long distance trips, we went to a wedding in Colorado. And I remember, I remember he said, okay, let's, let's start trying. Let's start trying for a baby.
I'm terrified, but let's do it. And so we did while we were long distance and I got pregnant while we were long distance. Immediately, the first time we tried, which was insane because in my mind I was like, it's probably gonna take a year of trying before we have to do fertility treatments and then get pregnant. So the timeline was just so different. So suddenly that put pressure on, now we have to be together. Like we're gonna have a baby and.
Jacqueline (30:04.651)
immediately.
Jacqueline (30:11.225)
Right.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (30:24.704)
nine months, 10 months, you know, like we better be in the same location. So that's kind of like, you know, to his credit, he really worked hard to find ways to do long, you know, like a remote last year of law school while we had a baby. But that was crazy. I was fully pregnant and we were flying back and forth to see each other. So I had a full pregnancy.
Jacqueline (30:41.529)
Mm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (30:53.558)
you know, until the very like last month or two, you know, by myself. So, yeah, we had a long distance like pregnancy. It was crazy.
Jacqueline (31:04.153)
How did you get the support you needed through the pregnancy?
Dr. Kibby McMahon (31:07.426)
I freaked out, was like an anxious wreck. You remember me, I was like a total anxious wreck. was, physically it was really tough. I didn't expect that to happen. Like there were many days where lugging the laundry up and down my stairs and just doing like, bringing the trash out by myself as like a fully pregnant woman by myself, it was really, really hard. Emotionally you wanna.
Jacqueline (31:31.609)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (31:33.814)
at the time you want to like nest and want to be close to them and want to feel safe. I was surprised to feel like my autonomy didn't feel safe anymore. Like being alone was scary. You know, if I heard weird noises in the house, I would be extra scared because it was just like me and this like baby. And flying, I remember actually I found it really difficult to fly because I would fly to him quite a bit to Los Angeles. And you know, after a while,
Jacqueline (31:45.241)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (32:02.966)
flying with a full pregnant belly was tough. And then, yeah, just like hanging out late at night in an airport trying to find a taxi, suddenly like my instinct kicked on like, want my man to protect me. It was just weird. So I was very withdrawn. I was very scared of more anxious and paranoid than I normally was. And then it was.
Jacqueline (32:27.79)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (32:30.023)
way better when we got together. We finally came together in New York.
Jacqueline (32:33.665)
Okay. There wasn't any like adjustment from knowing each other in a particular way to... Because that was also like in my... in some of my other long distance... I had like one six month long distance scenario with this guy who was so hot. He didn't love me. It was a shame, but he was really hot and every time I talk about him I just have to like make it clear how hot he was because that was like his defining characteristic. Anyway. We...
You know, we did quite well long distance and then when we come in person, it was, there was some awkwardness. And I don't know if that's because we were just too used to like the, how we communicated long distance or if it's because he didn't love me and just wanted to have sex with me and didn't really know how to communicate that. I don't know. I actually.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (33:23.79)
Did you talk a lot when you were apart? Like did you have that emotional connection when you were not together or? Hmm.
Jacqueline (33:28.921)
Until the end. mean, think he was into me for a little while, I actually, it's funny, like when I was in high school, I had a long distance situation. This guy named Phil, we knew each other from a politics club and he lived in Ohio and we talked on the phone every night. And then I went to prom with him in Ohio, but we had to drive from this like politics convention to Ohio together. And it was so awkward.
Like I lost all ability to talk to him. That memory is probably what has made me be able to talk to a brick wall now. I'm like, that's never happening again. Cause then he ghosted me immediately afterwards. But I just remember this car ride and being like, I don't know how to talk to this person. don't know what to say. Like I can tell he's trying. I'm sort of trying, but it's just so awkward. I mean, that's a 17 year old tragedy. I don't think I would encounter that now, but it is weird to go from.
Like that was another thing I was worried about with Jason. Like his texting tone doesn't match how he speaks at all. So was like, if I get too used to his texting, then he in person is going to feel weird to me. That hasn't really happened, but there's another chemistry thing I was worried about.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (34:35.832)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (34:39.372)
That's interesting. That's really interesting. Yeah. There's sometimes a special chemistry over text that, you you see it, you see it in love. Love is blind, right? Like they can, connect in a very particular format because it's like, you're just talking or, and maybe there's a connection that, that happens just in that format. And then in person it's gone. yeah, that's really interesting. I remember too,
Jacqueline (34:46.839)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (35:03.053)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (35:10.238)
And technology has a big piece in all of this too, like the growing technology, because I remember I would meet someone in summer camp and we would be dating or whatever, and then we would just afterwards it would be phone calls and emails. Emails were like, whoa, you know, but like there would be phone calls. And that would launch people into like a little bit more of a confessional state, you know, like being really open and just like talking, like, you know.
Jacqueline (35:24.397)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (35:27.734)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (35:38.776)
But then when you get all the feedback of being in person, it might be weird. So that's a really interesting thing of long distance relationships being better sometimes in the long distance.
Jacqueline (35:49.025)
Yeah, I mean, I think I was worried more about the reverse, that our chemistry would die because we're better in person. I mean, think it can go, it's bi-directional. And it's just like one of those nerve-racking things. I mean, if I'm thinking about, I don't feel like my relationship is actually the best example to talk about when we think about like the pitfalls of long distance. But if I have like an anxious attached partner or an avoidantly attached partner, like if...
If one of the partners were really anxious, like what would be a potential pitfall? By the way, where's a light source? Like what can I... It's getting dark in here.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (36:27.086)
Does your thing not work?
Jacqueline (36:29.323)
It works, it's just...
Dr. Kibby McMahon (36:34.574)
You could turn that light up. You could go to the back of it and click so that there's more light.
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (36:48.29)
Yeah, it's good.
Jacqueline (36:49.527)
Okay. Because I just, I, there are so many pitfalls if you think about anxiety here. Like, if Jason were an anxious partner, I would be having a really different experience in New York.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (37:03.458)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I became an anxiously attached partner when I was pregnant. Like, really, I became more hooked on when he responded back to me, when we're gonna see each other, missing him. And there's also research showing that, like, there's a little bit more idealizing, like, the heart, the heart, distance makes the heart grow fonder, right? So it's like, you're apart and you get to miss each other.
Jacqueline (37:09.453)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (37:27.907)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (37:32.672)
and idealize about all the things that you love and miss about them, right? Instead of taking them for granted by being right next to you. yeah, I mean, I remember feeling that anxious all the time and I'm sure now there's probably all these different ways that people stay connected even if they're not actively talking, like sharing location, different kinds of like shared activities online, like Netflix party.
Jacqueline (37:39.16)
Right.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (38:01.526)
which is now, I think, something else, but like watching movies separately together or like playing games online. So there's all different ways to like stay connected so you're not relying just on that text or that call or that one conversation. But I think it's hard. I think it's really hard because you're... The distance lets you fill in space, fill in the space with your own insecurities, right?
Jacqueline (38:28.907)
Yeah, I mean my experience with Eric and the hot guy, Nikolai, they, we both more or less started out, mean Eric and I had some runway in person, but the distance definitely increased idealization because I just filled in the gaps with my own daydreams and fantasies about them.
And yeah, Eric and I played Civilization over these like five hour FaceTime dates. Like Eric and I in some ways were more actively long distance than Jason and I are. And I think that's because Eric and I didn't have a return date. But yeah, I mean, we would have these marathon like playing this game so that again, the pressure of just talking at each other for five hours was kind of toned down. But like, I think it would be hard.
The problem with an anxious partner in a long distance situation is that when the anxious partner at home doesn't want you to go out for fear that you will cheat or it will make them more anxious, right? You stay home with your partner. But when your anxious partner in long distance doesn't want you to go out, you stay home alone. And that's just not something that I think a lot of people would be interested in.
Like if Jason was like, please don't go to Glen Gary Glen Ross, I'd be like, okay, well now I'm missing out on Glen Gary Glen Ross and I'm alone. sitting in my cardboard box in New York. And so I don't know how you do it without like really strong regulation skills for jealousy and insecurity. I mean, I cannot imagine. I was very faithful to my birth control.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (39:52.152)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (40:13.773)
this year, because I was like, I do not want to be long distance and pregnant. So I really don't know how you did that. Because you were literally physically vulnerable. Like, what if you had a miscarriage?
Dr. Kibby McMahon (40:23.149)
Yeah, yeah. No, there were, I mean, I had COVID. I got COVID even though I was vaccinated. I got COVID while I was pregnant, while I was like second trimester. I was so sick. I couldn't move. And that made it, like, I still had to work. I still had to like walk up and down the stairs. So yeah, that anxiety and feeling like I need that person, I want them close to me was tough. And I think what it also did was,
you know, then you're, there's more time and space for your insecurities to run amok. And so like, whenever we have insecurities with relationships, a lot of it could be just like these core beliefs, these like old blueprints that we're just like projecting onto our new partner, right? Like, fear that they will leave me, you know, like I'll just be left alone. They don't actually love me. so when that was activated, that was super intense when I was pregnant. And so,
Anytime we had a kind of a not great conversation or he wasn't responding, I kind of went into like, like this means all the bad things. Yeah. And I remember we would have, we had like more fights, definitely. I mean, we also had more fights because it was like, we don't even know when we were going to be together. You know, like our future was together was so tough to navigate and figure out.
But the fights were tough because we would be texting each other insecure, at least I was insecure, and then we would misread each other. Like I remember we had a huge fight because he missed, like I was anxiously ruminating at him through text, and I think he read the tone as more like, here's what it was. We were talking about when we're gonna propose, when we're gonna propose and we were gonna.
get together and I thought that we were going to get engaged earlier than he thought, right? And I was talking at him about how sad I was and anxious about that and I was like, well, maybe it's actually a good thing that we have more time to get engaged because we have a lot of things to figure out, right? But he read it as, well, maybe it's a good thing that we are not getting engaged right now because we have a lot of things to figure out.
Jacqueline (42:46.499)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (42:48.468)
Hugh got so mad and he got so hurt. And we got into this huge fight and I was kind of confused. So he was upset and then the things that he said and acted triggered me to be upset because he was more cold and distant. And it spiraled and it was like a couple day fight. We didn't talk, which is a little bit easier when you're not, when you're long distance. Like I basically like cut him off.
you know, like I used to mouth for a couple of days because I needed to like process. I was so upset after that conversation. Whereas I think we probably would have talked more, like resolved it faster if we were in person because we have to be right at each other. But when we really spelled it out, it was a lot of this miscommunication and misreading of my tone. There was a lot of other things around it, but that was really the thing that set off his insecurities. So.
That is like what's such a downfall of like both of us being anxious and long distance is that you are, you have that really narrow channel of connection and that channel is fuzzy and breaks down, then the whole thing is a mess.
Jacqueline (44:03.511)
can't even imagine being long distance pregnant in that new to a relationship where like, wow, if he leaves me, I am so fucked. Like I am so alone with this. And then to have all the perils of texting as your major communication source. Woof.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (44:22.498)
Yeah, and you know me as a texter. I'm like, text, text, text. Most of time I'm texting on my computer. So I'm just like, type, type, type, type. You know that meme of like, have you ever seen the Kermit meme on Instagram where he's just like furiously typing? That's me on text all the time and you know that very well. So I was just saying things and just not being mindful about how it comes across. So yeah, that's a huge pitfall. Like when you don't...
Jacqueline (44:27.927)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (44:36.867)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (44:43.306)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (44:49.442)
The more ambiguity you have in a relationship, the more you can project your insecurities into it, right? Like that's really where insecurities come into play is like, don't know the answer, you don't know what the other person is thinking. So I'm just gonna fill in what default fear I have. They don't love me, they're gonna abandon me, they're gonna leave, you know, whatever. And then that becomes how you interpret that silence or that ambiguous interaction.
Jacqueline (45:09.977)
I don't know.
Jacqueline (45:13.677)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (45:17.301)
I remember that well. I also, I feel like there's this thing that I did slash do, which was, I think I saved up my discontents for when I was in person, which isn't necessarily dumb. I mean, it's a double edged sword. Like I think I wanted to avoid the insecurity that comes from a text fight or a phone fight and then all of the space that you can have.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (45:31.854)
Hmm
Jacqueline (45:47.531)
available to you after that.
I didn't want to
Dr. Kibby McMahon (45:53.102)
It's unusual actually. I think that I would say in my experience, I can't remember the research, but I was hesitant to bring up any bad stuff when we're together because we only have like three days together. I want to make this awesome, right? You don't want to spend the whole time fighting. But then afterwards when we would be distant, I would bring up. And actually I wanted to talk about this, I couldn't.
Jacqueline (46:07.884)
Amazing.
Jacqueline (46:21.08)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (46:21.674)
you save the fights for the main parts in time.
Jacqueline (46:23.705)
I do, but I don't think it was conscious necessarily. I think I was probably steeped in some insecurity like while we were apart and then when we were together, it probably all came out. mean, including like when I... Jason and I have an amazing relationship, okay. But he's also like one of the only people that sees me very emotional most of the time. So for a while, like every visit...
the first night I would cry over something. But I'd be pissed at him about something. So it's gotten to the point where he's like, I visited this a week or two ago, a week ago, and was starting to get really in my head about something he said. He was like, we are not doing this. How do we turn this ship around? We're not crying tonight. We've got to have a weekend where this doesn't happen. I don't know. think...
Like Jason and have only had one fight this whole time, but it kind of recurs, which is the travel fight. And so like whenever we're... No, the travel fight is, Jason, when are you going to go to Belize with me? This man refuses to leave the country, but he says that he wants to, and he says that he has no problem. It's just, you know, it's just practical, et cetera, et cetera. So anyways.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (47:29.598)
when you're traveling to see each other.
Jacqueline (47:47.723)
When we are in person, any time travel is alluded to, I'll take the bait. And whenever Eric and I were in person, we would break up. But I don't know if that was my fault.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (48:00.686)
Do you feel like things are resolved better when you have the argument in person versus like over text or when you're apart?
Jacqueline (48:08.696)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (48:11.96)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (48:12.622)
Yeah, interesting. I mean, this is a good segue into best practices or tips for long distance relationships. What would you say are the tips for making a long distance relationship as healthy as you can?
Jacqueline (48:27.673)
I mean, think if you have a problem, you should bring it up. You shouldn't store it and wait until you see each other in person because you do want to protect that time and you don't want to be storing up a resentment or anything like that. But I do think it just can be true that like the things that you've thought about alone can kind of like pop up when you're together finally. I don't know. mean,
I think having a really honest conversation about your needs for autonomy versus control is going to be important. Like, if one of you is anxious, how is it going to work that one of your, one of the partners is just not going to be there and you won't know what they're up to? And like, I think it can be easy for, especially the person who's moving to like agree to stuff like, yeah, I'll totally, we'll have a nightly call. If Jason and had a nightly call, I would not be experiencing New York.
Like I just don't see how that would be possible, right?
Maybe if we had the same bedtime and we did like a right before bedtime call that would work, but his bedtime is like 9 p.m. Like there's most of the time I'm out. So like how much is, how much are check-ins actually going to be worse for us versus, you know, helping our relationship? And then yeah, I've been some way to make it so that you two are observing the same things at some point.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (49:39.608)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (49:56.769)
So I did like playing Civilization with Eric. I thought that that was a good way to have something to do that kept us on the phone. And yeah, Paul and I would do some, I think we would watch movies at the same time. We were never long distance, but just like when I was on, like when I was visiting family or something. I think there are certainly, you can have date nights. Eric and I would always basically just get.
when I was 23, but Jason would just get plastered on the phone. We'd have these like five hour marathon talks, but it was like a date, you know? It's like something to look forward to. So that kind of thing can work. I do think knowing when you're gonna see each other next is helpful, but you have to really keep in mind the individual partners. I'm somebody who thrives off of flexibility, and it wouldn't work super well for Jason and me to have come up with.
a bunch of rules for how we were going to do this and bunch of expectations. Like it works far more that he is just flexible with me and then, you know, there's no expectation that like I have to be somewhere at a certain time unless we pre-arrange it.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (50:54.04)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (51:06.316)
Yeah, I think it makes sense to, if you know yourself well and how you like to communicate and connect with a partner, that really helps. But then if you're already deep into a long distance relationship and you're feeling this out, then I guess it's worth it to check in with yourself and the other person. do I feel connected to them? How connected do I feel? Like, do I actually feel the distance in more ways than one, emotionally and physically? Because
Jacqueline (51:29.401)
No.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (51:37.044)
Yeah, all these different ways of checking in, call like emotional calls and like long distance relationship, like the different ways that you have emotional calls might feel satisfying enough or for one person not, right? Like I remember Alex and I would text each other about, you know, funny things that happened that day or what we're doing, you know, we're just, we still do that as a married couple. Like, we'll tell, like, how was your day? love you.
Jacqueline (51:47.822)
Mm.
Jacqueline (51:58.969)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (52:02.008)
But if one, if the other person doesn't feel like that's enough, like they don't feel connected, they want like more FaceTime calls, or they want more shared activities, or they want more, you know, like just making sure that that level of connection makes sense. And it's actually like bringing that person closer versus not.
Jacqueline (52:18.126)
Yeah.
Yeah. One thing I'll say, this is actually probably the most annoying part of the long distance relationship, and it doesn't have that much to do with Jason, but it's when your job gives you a limited number of PTO and you have to spend it all on your partner, I don't know how you do that year after year. I mean, I can do it for this year, but I'm basically telling my mom, look, I'm not going to see you for six months because Christmas has passed.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (52:35.086)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (52:45.525)
And like, tell, you know, my friends, like, I was asked to be a godmother and they want me for the christening. But I'm like, I don't know when I can come to the christening because I'm spending every single day I have on my boyfriend. And so I don't know if you can plan joint trips together. yeah. If you can somehow like get on neutral territory, sometimes it's not, this is one of the reasons I wanted to go to Belize. It's like, it doesn't have to be your place or my place. It can be this new place where we have this special time. It's, we're not just a visitor.
I think it would be helpful. yeah, negotiating that PTO thing is tough.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (53:18.496)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, it really does like box out that time for that other person. If you can like go with your partner to like seeing your family or, you know, seeing your godchild, like that would be two in one. But I understand how people want to get protective over the date visits. But yeah, I think that's hard. That's really hard.
Jacqueline (53:39.469)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (53:44.428)
Yeah, having that neutral territory was nice. Like sometimes it's an interesting thing to visit their home and then them visit your home. Who's the host? There's some dynamics around who's the host, right? Like, I have to plan all these things. I have to make this fun and blah, blah, But even just being like, okay, let's actually meet somewhere. I think my cousin actually, my cousin and his wife were long distance for many years and they would just plan vacations.
Jacqueline (53:55.193)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (54:12.814)
to a whole new place that they both wanna go to to see each other. And they loved that. They thought that was super fun, because it gave them an excuse to like, you know, see each other and have a vacation and explore other countries too. So Belize might be your next.
Jacqueline (54:16.152)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (54:29.241)
Well, I think leaning into the spirit of long distance is a really good idea. the thing that Eric...
my God, the thing that Jason and I have gained through long distance is the chance to see each other just cut loose and have fun and like be on vacation together. Every time I see him work, you know, basically on vacation. And that's very different from what I get at home. So you can do that, but like turn the dial up, right? Like Nikolai and I, we met at a wedding in Brazil and then I flew to Hawaii where he lived. And then we met in Mexico city. Like it doesn't always have to be one of your homes. can be this, it can be a bit more of a whirlwind. Like, you know, like, yeah, like let's go to.
freaking London for the weekend if we want. Because we have to fly anyway, so might as well fly somewhere cool.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (55:15.31)
Yeah, It's making me, it is making me nostalgic for the time that Alex and I were long distance. I think in my mind, sometimes I think of that time as like the non part of relationship. It almost like is that pause time? But I'm like, my gosh, there was so much, there was so much there. And part of it was like, it fueled the excitement.
Jacqueline (55:29.145)
Mm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (55:39.662)
You know, when we saw each other, it would be so much more exciting. But then it was also like, you're just waiting for your relationship to start, to wait to see what it's like to actually live together and start a life together. So I know in some ways, like it was really, I mean, we even did finding out what is the, whether our kid was gonna be a boy or girl long distance. We went on Zoom together.
Jacqueline (55:49.433)
night.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (56:06.316)
And then we pulled up the results from the doctor together so we could see it on a shared screen and then had that experience like separately. So that's just crazy to think about. But I definitely think that shared experiences in general, the more you can do that so you don't live separate lives, like just reporting to each other. yeah, like I think, you know, playing games.
Jacqueline (56:13.561)
Hmm.
Jacqueline (56:25.123)
Yeah.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (56:33.034)
Like there's all sorts, everyone's into like Whirl, Whirl, what is it? Scrabble Whirl things online. Reading the same book together, watching the same show, you know, that's definitely something that people like do where they binge watch the same show and like start at the same time and watch it. Like that Netflix party thing. there's also like some apps that do it too. I think, let me see, hold on, pause the conversation.
Jacqueline (56:37.881)
murder
Jacqueline (56:41.902)
Right.
Jacqueline (56:53.507)
Yeah, happy.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (57:06.254)
Like, I don't know if these are still things, but there's like an app called Between. And there's like...
different, let's see, there's different apps for virtual dates that you guys could look up. There's all sorts of, and there's also sending handwritten letters or care packages. Sometimes even just when you have the physicality missing, you could add the physicality and actually mailing a surprise to them.
Jacqueline (57:39.373)
Yeah, I think like, especially if it's temporary, like, anytime something is temporary, even if it sucks, it's gonna present opportunities that you won't get normally. one of, like, you're never gonna write each other handwritten notes when you're in a close proximity relationship. So if you've ever wanted to exchange love letters, like, do it, you know? I'm probably, like, I might get proposed to in New York City. I don't know that that would have happened if...
if I weren't in New York City right now. We're so North Carolina oriented. I also think, I mean, think there's two other major components I would talk about. One is you want to create a situation where you have shared experiences and where you feel connected, but I also, I think the other peril of not experiencing the place where you're in.
and like putting everything into the relationship is that it might increase your pain level in the long distance relationship because suddenly you're living for the relationship and the relationship is not taking the form that it ideally would and so then it's easier to feel the unideal parts. Like if I were just living for Jason right now then I wouldn't be able to lean into the fact that I love New York and there's so much to do here and that I get the opportunity one more time to experience it and my friends and
That's awesome. I do think one thing that helps though to not just feel like you're living totally different lives is to see Jason and have not hit this balance. Well, we've actually, maybe we have a little bit. Whenever he comes to town or whenever I go to town, it's very tempting to spend all of our time together. And I love that and I don't mind it, but it might be better, especially if we weren't gonna come back together in five months.
to introduce him more to my friends here so that he actually feels like he has a bit of a life here too.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (59:38.968)
Yeah, or let him wander around and do something just for him. Like just have like some time, which is really hard, but like if there's anything that he's interested in exploring in New York without you, although that wouldn't necessarily happen, but just to feel like it's not just Jaclyn, but it's just like, you know, a cool trip that he gets a bunch of different experiences in. But it's hard either way.
Jacqueline (59:46.073)
No.
Jacqueline (59:50.872)
Yeah.
Jacqueline (59:57.675)
Mm-hmm.
Jacqueline (01:00:01.741)
Yeah, and not just the city that he resents for taking me away from him, right? But like a place where he actually has some connection to.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (01:00:05.23)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (01:00:11.584)
We have to wrap up because I gotta bounce, but any final...
Jacqueline (01:00:17.721)
I always think the state of a union addresses are like a good idea whenever a relationship is maybe going through something unusual, really checking in, how are we doing, is there anything we need to adjust here, being really honest about how you feel but also like I think if you're oriented towards I want my partner to be happy and I want them to actually experience their life and not just be living for like the limited contact they get with me, I think that can be a very helpful orientation towards the relationship.
And then just like really lean into creativity and figure out how to make this a good thing for your relationship and not just pressing the pause button.
Dr. Kibby McMahon (01:00:59.789)
I think that's great. And we could look up different apps or activities and stuff like that and link it to the show notes. So we'll add that in. Give you guys some suggestions for what to do.
Jacqueline (01:01:05.209)
Cool.
Jacqueline (01:01:10.637)
Alright little helpers, well I know that we are all in a long distance relationship so if you'd like to write us a little love letter on Apple Podcasts or Spotify with a five star review that would enhance our connection and we'll see you next week.
